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Title: They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
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pdudkowski
 Author    



Rank:none
Status:Navy Veteran
Score: 221
Posts: 221
From: USA
Registered: 01/04/2004
Time spent: 0 hours

(Date Posted:08/03/2009 11:18:50)

Representative Poe has always been a strong supporter for National Defense, our military and Veterans. This however seems to be more in support of Ronald Wilson Reagan who the GOP insist won the Cold War without us than it is for us.

Whereas November 9, 2009, marks the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall and the symbolic end of the Cold War; (Engrossed as Agreed to or Passed by House)

HRES 496 EH

H. Res. 496

In the House of Representatives, U. S.,

July 29, 2009.

Whereas November 9, 2009, marks the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall and the symbolic end of the Cold War ;

Whereas the Cold War was an enduring struggle between communism and democracy throughout the second half of the 20th century;

Whereas the last United States President to speak at the Brandenburg Gate prior to the destruction of the Berlin Wall was President Ronald Reagan, who, in June 1987, stated, `General Secretary Gorbachev, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Soviet Union and Eastern Europe, if you seek liberalization: Come here to this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, open this gate! Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!';

Whereas two years later, in September 1989, protests that the East Germans called the `Peaceful Revolution' broke out, with protestors at first chanting `We want out!', and then gradually changing that protest cry to `We're staying here!', demonstrating their desire for democracy in their part of Germany;

Whereas on November 9, 1989, in response to protests that had grown to include over 1,000,000 people in Berlin's Alexanderplatz, Gunter Schabowski, the communist East German Minister of Propaganda, announced that the border would be opened for `private trips abroad';

Whereas thousands of people in East Berlin immediately flooded the checkpoints at the Berlin Wall and demanded entry into West Berlin causing the overwhelmed East German Border Guards to open the border checkpoints to allow people to cross into West Berlin;

Whereas people in West Berlin enthusiastically greeted those coming across from East Berlin, dancing atop the Berlin Wall and hammering chunks out of it until a section opened through which more East Germans walked and shouted out `Freedom! Freedom! Just once, Freedom!';

Whereas over 400,000,000 people were freed from the bondage of communism at the end of the Cold War in Russia, Belarus, Ukraine, Moldova, Georgia, Azerbaijan, Armenia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, East Germany, Poland, Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Romania, Bulgaria, Latvia, Estonia, and Lithuania;

Whereas the victory of the United States in the Cold War will signify freedom from oppression for decades to come;

Whereas Berlin, Germany, will celebrate the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall with the `Festival of Freedom'; and

Whereas the fall of the Berlin Wall was one of the most significant events of the 20th century and symbolized the triumph of democracy over communism: Now, therefore, be it

    Resolved, That the House of Representatives--

      (1) recognizes the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin Wall;

      (2) celebrates 20 years of freedom from the bondage of communism with the people of the former communist countries; and

      (3) acknowledges the symbolic triumph of democracy over communism.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Paul V. Dudkowski
Charter Member, ACWV
US Navy, 1973 to 1978
"Dedicated to the Cause"

JIM WELLER
1# 



Rank:none
Status:Still Serving
Score:388
Posts:388
From: USA
Registered:05/19/2008
Time spent: 13245 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/03/2009 16:55:16)

I'll give President Reagan his due, but so has most everyone else.  He did give the military what we needed and today we are still living off that build-up, but the weapons systems are getting old.  But, the military COLD WARRIOR has not been recognized again.  SAD.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Pennsylvania Keystone State Director ACWV

"History does not entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." --Dwight D. Eisenhower

"PEACE THROUGH STRENGTH !!"

Guest



RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/03/2009 18:19:48)

I liked Ronald Reagan a lot, but he never served in the military to my knowledge, but may have made some training films during and for WW II.  He started off as a Democrat, then switched to a Republican in later years, became governor of California and finally as we know President.  He did many good things and some not so good, which probably makes him about an average guy (in my book).  He failed the Marines - Lebanon after the barracks bombing, did not make it right, but blew the shorts off of Kdafi, gave Gorby a nice home on the Presideo Grounds (my old parade ground)............so who knows.  What we do know is that all who served between 1945 to 1991 did win the Cold War.  Back then I believe we were too busy winning it and later on had faith that we would be remembered.  Judge Poe is generally right on in many respects, but missed the right call on this.  Again, it's what men do, not what they say that counts for something.

jim811
bELKNAP
3# 



From: USA
Registered:03/26/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/04/2009 06:25:18)

Let's ask Rep. Poe if he would consider adding an amendment to his bill authorizing Cold War Medal as the "symbol of triumph" he speaks of...this as a companion to Senator Snowe's bill (has that been officially introduced yet?)...send him petitions...history of other legislative efforts, VSO suipport, list of other congressional support, etc.

bELKNAP
NACVSO Leg
4# 



Rank:none
Score:3
Posts:3
Registered:07/12/2004
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/04/2009 11:01:52)

Guest.....Ronald Reagan, like many in his generation, did serve in the military during World War II.  He was an Army Officer assigned to make training films based on his experience as an actor.  Not quite the infantry, but he did in fact serve.  I'm sure that he was like a lot of us and just did what he was told.  The military does assign people to their strengths in a lot of cases.  I agree that he seemed to be an ordinary guy who performed admirably in given circumstances.  Perhaps that was his appeal to the electorate.  I for one believe he was anything but ordinary.  I did not serve under President Reagan.  I served under Nixon, Ford and Carter.  Six years was enough for me.
jim811
5# 



From: USA
Registered:07/10/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/04/2009 11:19:50)

I do stand to be corrected and thank you for bringing me up to speed. RWR did serve as a Captain in the Army Air Force, in a noncombatic role like many.

jim811
jim811
6# 



From: USA
Registered:07/10/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/04/2009 11:28:55)

I served under Dwight David Eisenhower and I admit, I may be a little partial.  By the way I am a member of this unit, not a guest, my friend.

jim811

JIM WELLER
7# 



Rank:none
Status:Still Serving
Score:388
Posts:388
From: USA
Registered:05/19/2008
Time spent: 13245 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/04/2009 15:25:53)

I'm sure that it is an over sight by Rep. Poe.  I'm sure he isn't anti-vet, but he should submit another resolution. 
Also, Reagan asked to serve in combat, but his eyesight was lacking for combat flight status.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Pennsylvania Keystone State Director ACWV

"History does not entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." --Dwight D. Eisenhower

"PEACE THROUGH STRENGTH !!"

pdudkowski
8# 



Rank:none
Status:Navy Veteran
Score:221
Posts:221
From: USA
Registered:01/04/2004
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/05/2009 05:27:33)

Rep. Poe is a very strong advocate for the military and Veterans. His dad served as my chaplain in our Legion Post when I was Commander and he always gave me insight into his son. I've been given his private e-mail once in the past to communicate with him on the Cold War and I dare not abuse that fact and press his dad. Rep. Poe is also a strong partisan Republican and rarely crosses over.

Since he is just introducing a resolution and not a bill that could become law, including a CWM is a non-starter. I am not discounting the fact that using his own resolution to drive the need for a CW bill that includes a medal is in the realm of possibility but it is how to get to him. He is not my representative in the House.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Paul V. Dudkowski
Charter Member, ACWV
US Navy, 1973 to 1978
"Dedicated to the Cause"

bELKNAP
9# 



From: USA
Registered:03/26/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/05/2009 06:20:30)

I understand Paul.  I did write to him.  Just thinking at some point he might be a good advocate.  Thank you.

bELKNAP
coldwarrior
10# 



Registered:12/21/2003
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/05/2009 15:36:30)

 http://www.tampicohistoricalsociety.com/albums/album_image/359307/88964.htm

Ronald Reagan was also a reserve Army officer in the Cavalry before the war.  He started out as enlisted in the Cavalry and worked his way up to Captain.  He served for 16 years in the Cavalry, Transportation, and finally in the Army Airforce, in a special film unit.

Just a side note...when he was a lifeguard, he personally saved 77 lives.

He was a governor of the most populous state in the US and finally served as POTUS for eight years.

He was great.  True, he never was a community organizer, but he was the president of a union.

We need another president like him.


(Message edited by coldwarrior On 08/05/2009 15:37:20)

--------------------------------------------------------------
On 12 June, 1987 at the Brandenburg Gate, West Berlin, President Ronald Reagan said, "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall!"

On 9 November, 1989 THE WALL CAME DOWN !!!

jim811
11# 



From: USA
Registered:07/10/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/06/2009 13:45:16)

Yup, I agree.

jim811
LebanonGrenadaEraVet
12# 



Registered:08/22/2005
Time spent: 0 hours

Re:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/06/2009 18:44:16)

Ask members of the Air Traffic Controllers of 1981 PATCO how they feel about him.  A definate UNION BUSTER and ANTI-LABOR.  He busted up PATCO and in 1987, the "Scabs" formed their own union now making well over 165,000 bucks per year plus all kinds of benefits.  The only point he made was that he could bust up a union, fire its employees because HE COULD.  Looks like the real losers were some 18000 employees that never got their jobs back.  Maybe 800 out of all those guys fired some 12 years later when Clinton took away the "Never be able to be rehired in government" from the clause.  

--------------------------------------------------------------
"Everybody's talkin 'bout the new kid in town but I don't wanna hear it".

pdudkowski
13# 



Rank:none
Status:Navy Veteran
Score:221
Posts:221
From: USA
Registered:01/04/2004
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/07/2009 05:25:10)

I started this thread to show the continuation of past Congressional behavior regarding the Cold War. Routinely included in speeches and resolutions, it shows the Congress is painfully aware of the Cold War and sacrifices made. They just choose to white wash the facts that there was a human element involved in that victory. That element is us and the millions more. When they keep using the word "Victory" it will continue to ring hollow with me until someone finally recognizes how that victory was achieved.

This was not a thread started to elevate Reagan to sainthood or cast him as a pawn of Satan. Pretty easy to get off track, isn't it.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Paul V. Dudkowski
Charter Member, ACWV
US Navy, 1973 to 1978
"Dedicated to the Cause"

jidavis
14# 



Registered:09/07/2005
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/13/2009 09:17:30)

With HR.496 (Recognizing the 20th anniversary of the fall of the Berlin) passing in the house 432-0 on July 29th, what is the next step?  Does this go to the Senate to vote?

jim811
15# 



From: USA
Registered:07/10/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/13/2009 09:24:16)

Paul D is right, until our elected officials recognize the human element (us folks) and those of us who were lost in the struggle, their political posturing for votes will ring hollow.

jim811
pdudkowski
16# 



Rank:none
Status:Navy Veteran
Score:221
Posts:221
From: USA
Registered:01/04/2004
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/13/2009 12:49:34)

Reply JIDAVIS: At this point I don't think anything will go to the Senate. This was not a bill trying to become a law but more of a "Sense of the Congress" type thing. Obviously one of the few items to come before the House that they could all agree on. It has no legal requirements and just acknowledges they are aware the Cold War is over and the Berlin Wall came down. In other words, while I'm glad they passed it, they are just "showing off" the fact that someone taught them a history lesson and they accepted it as fact. It cost them nothing.

--------------------------------------------------------------
Paul V. Dudkowski
Charter Member, ACWV
US Navy, 1973 to 1978
"Dedicated to the Cause"

jim811
17# 



From: USA
Registered:07/10/2009
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/15/2009 10:11:57)

REPLY TO JIDAVIS:  No, to my knowledge it's just a " sense of the House resolution "; not a legislative bill, but JI your post does raise an interesting point never the less.  I am curious if the Senate has presented a companion resolution and if so, it certainly would be "enlightening" to see how the vote would go, but then again it might be 100% (my guess).  If it were modified to include all Cold War Military Personnel, then what would the vote be?  That could be very enlightening; ie, who's for vs who's against and; that would be good to know.

jim811
jidavis
18# 



Registered:09/07/2005
Time spent: 0 hours

RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/16/2009 09:03:34)

Jim811,

I see that Senator Olympia Snowe has yet to introduce a Cold War Medal Bill as she stated she would in her reply to ACWV member Jerald Terwilliger:  http://americancoldwarvets.aimoo.com/Cold-War-Medal/Some-Good-News-1-1504585.html

Thinking outloud maybe HR.496 can be continued to the Senate by Senator Snowe combining a senate version of HR.496 and creating a Cold War Medal language into (1) bill.

Any status of what Senator Snowe creating a Cold War Medal bill?

Any news on Rep Rob Andrews of NJ 1st District introducing a new Cold War Medal bill as he has in the past? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_War_Victory_Medal

Thanks
-jidavis

Guest



RE:They still call it 'Our Victory' but do nothing for us.
(Date Posted:08/16/2009 10:20:48)

JIDAVIS:   JI, for myself, Jerry has gone a very long way in getting Senator Snow on our behalf and I would recommend Jerry's efforts are going forward.  I'm sure they are.  A "sence of the senate resolution" could be sponcored by another senator or Senator Snow, herself, but we should be careful not to create a situation wherein, Senator Snows commitment to Jerry would be compromised in any way.  Having said this, I still wonder if Rep. Poe's Resolution was ammended to include all Cold War Military Personnel and voted on in the senate, as a "sence of the senate", what would the vote be.  Something separate from Rep. Poe's Resolution could be a "sence of the senate resolution" on the Cold War Monument, a non profit effort not funded by public funds, then what would the senate vote be? Personally, I think would provide us with a view of who in the senate is willing to help us.  The same could be done oin the house.  Having said all of this, this so important and would need the ACWV's Board of approval and would need to be actionable by the Board, we can't have 1 or 5 different people trying to accomplish the samer thing separately.  My thoughts.

jim811
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Honoring Cold War Veterans on NPR Weekend America 12-27-08



MISSION

The American Cold War Veterans is a nonpartisan 501c nonprofit veterans service organization incorporated in the State of Florida and founded on August 18, 2007 at The Truman Library in Independence, MO. As a group we are dedicated to all of our Brother and Sister Veterans, with special dedication to those who served during the Cold War era September 1945 to December 1991. Our Mission is to bring respect, recognition and awareness to Veterans of the Cold War era no matter what branch of service, whether active duty, reserve or National Guard. We are committed to honoring the sacrifices made by millions of American men and women during the Cold War, especially those who paid the ultimate price of life or liberty. We intend to see that the Cold War's history is completely and accurately understood by people everywhere. We are united in these goals and speak with one voice.


NDAA 2002 - FACT


The NDAA 2002 was passed by congress October 2001 signed into Law Dec. 28 2001, In the NDAA that was approved by both houses, signed into law by the President, was the Sense of Congress to authorize the Campaign Medal for service in the Cold War.

NATIONAL DEFENSE AUTHORIZATION ACT FOR FISCAL YEAR 2002

115 STAT. 1118 PUBLIC LAW 107–107—DEC. 28, 2001 Code, that the award of the Distinguished Flying Cross to that individual is warranted and that a waiver of time restrictions prescribed by law for recommendation for such award is recommended.

SEC. 556. SENSE OF CONGRESS ON ISSUANCE OF CERTAIN MEDALS.
It is the sense of Congress that the Secretary of Defense should consider authorizing—

  1. the issuance of a campaign medal, to be known as the Korea Defense Service Medal, to each person who while a member of the Armed Forces served in the Republic of Korea, or the waters adjacent thereto, during the period beginning on July 28, 1954, and ending on such date thereafter as the Secretary considers appropriate;

  2. the issuance of a campaign medal, to be known as the Cold War Service Medal, to each person who while a member of the Armed Forces served satisfactorily on active duty during the Cold War; and

  3. the award of the Vietnam Service Medal to any member or former member of the Armed Forces who was awarded the Armed Forces Expeditionary Medal for participation in military operations designated as Operation Frequent Wind arising from the evacuation of Vietnam on April 29 and 30, 1975.


The Medal was not created! Why?

Were Cold War veterans casualties of the Iraq War planning?

We will continue to fight!

Wikipedia Background - Cold War Victory Medal




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